|
Post by T on Oct 15, 2007 8:54:49 GMT 10
The standard last night was Shtie!! I've long been complaining about the standard of refs in the A-League, but it is getting worse. There was one incident last night when Pecker head took out Hutch I think with the help of another QLD player... instead of giving the yellow where it was deserved which was to Pecker head, he gave it to the other QLD player who funnily enough did not already have one. Now I know its nice to share things around so one player doesn't feel left out, but that was just CRAP!
|
|
marinermick
Moderator
Coming to Bay 16 Soon
Posts: 8,657
|
Post by marinermick on Oct 15, 2007 8:58:05 GMT 10
You know it was a poor decision when even Danny Tiatto tells the ref he got it wrong I must have missed that. Even THE PENIS thinks it was harsh, that IS saying something yep, tiatto went to the referee and gave him a spray for the decision saw the final team sheet report after the match and tiatto's yellow card was written down by o'leary as "elbowing" isn't FIFA insisting this season that elbows are straight red cards? lawrie did well to stay calm - I said to lawrie after the game that the club should allow in their budget two opportunities for him to cut loose in the media and say what he really thinks about referees last night would have been the perfect opportunity and totally justifiable without people speaking out there will be no change
|
|
|
Post by Bearinator on Oct 15, 2007 9:08:46 GMT 10
Mick, im interested to know from where you were sitting, what was it?? Yellow, red, not even a free kick??
And from up there, did the ref do as bad as we are all going on about??
|
|
|
Post by Adz on Oct 15, 2007 9:11:39 GMT 10
|
|
marinermick
Moderator
Coming to Bay 16 Soon
Posts: 8,657
|
Post by marinermick on Oct 15, 2007 9:12:01 GMT 10
Mick, im interested to know from where you were sitting, what was it?? Yellow, red, not even a free kick?? And from up there, did the ref do as bad as we are all going on about?? my first impression was that it was nothing as both players slid in at the same time then had the luxury of seeing about eight replays smitta's right foot got the ball while his left leg was bent - minimal contact with the roar player who got up straight away i called it the worst decision ever made in a national league football match i have never been so fired up about an inept refereeing performance as i was last night
|
|
|
Post by Bearinator on Oct 15, 2007 9:16:56 GMT 10
HOW GOOD WAS THAT LATE SAVE BY REDDY OFF SIMON!!!!
|
|
|
Post by Perm on Oct 15, 2007 9:41:10 GMT 10
I must have missed that. Even THE PENIS thinks it was harsh, that IS saying something yep, tiatto went to the referee and gave him a spray for the decision saw the final team sheet report after the match and tiatto's yellow card was written down by o'leary as "elbowing" isn't FIFA insisting this season that elbows are straight red cards? lawrie did well to stay calm - I said to lawrie after the game that the club should allow in their budget two opportunities for him to cut loose in the media and say what he really thinks about referees last night would have been the perfect opportunity and totally justifiable without people speaking out there will be no change all last night i was thinking of a big banner saying HYUNDAI A-LEAGUE QUALITY FOOTBALLERS POOR REFEREES also i wonder if the HAL could sign a marquee ref.
|
|
|
Post by Pete on Oct 15, 2007 9:45:53 GMT 10
yep, tiatto went to the referee and gave him a spray for the decision saw the final team sheet report after the match and tiatto's yellow card was written down by o'leary as "elbowing" isn't FIFA insisting this season that elbows are straight red cards? lawrie did well to stay calm - I said to lawrie after the game that the club should allow in their budget two opportunities for him to cut loose in the media and say what he really thinks about referees last night would have been the perfect opportunity and totally justifiable without people speaking out there will be no change all last night i was thinking of a big banner saying HYUNDAI A-LEAGUE QUALITY FOOTBALLERS POOR REFEREES also i wonder if the HAL could sign a marquee ref. Yeah I think even Grahame Poll (Aus v Croatia, WC 2006, he with the 3 yellow card count) would be a superstar amongst those idiots. Last week there was an actual assault upon a match official and the culprit got a Yellow. This week a Mariners player gets a straight red card for what a couple of well credentialled people tell me was at best a 50/50 challenge. And on a player who doesn't have the reputation of being dirty, and is a decent young guy too. SUCKS. FFA please at least tell us if there's a f**king fix on, so we can bet accordingly. My paranoid side of the brain is starting to whisper that the FFA doesn't want the Mariners to get first past the post this year.
|
|
|
Post by thesandman on Oct 15, 2007 10:15:06 GMT 10
I ?...how about about dumping the lot of whistle blowers we have at the moment, getting the #1 female ref off the line and into the centre Beck - the WC female ref (Tammy Ogsten) isn't the girl that we've got running HAL lines (Sarah Ho). If Porter gets more than 1 week, then we've all got problems - as that would suggest the FFA would agree with the send off (for the record, they cannot completely rescind the card). Surely we've got the worst disciplinary record by now, but it's mostly undeserved. Our red cards have all come off the back of referee f*** ups
|
|
|
Post by Pete on Oct 15, 2007 10:18:49 GMT 10
If the FFA was serious about having professional standards they would say the send off of Porter was a bloody mistake made by the ref in the heat of the moment and leave it at that.
I don't think they can rescind the ref's decision to red card him (and credit it to his record), but they could at least say there's no suspension. And any future judiciary appearances by Porter should be told that the red card for this game was a bloody mistake, and not taken into account.
I would just like to see some decent professional level refereeing to be honest. If the best ref happens to be female then fine, put her on NOW.
Would love to see the reactions of some of the players who would usually stand up to the ref and argue, if the ref was a female and a good ref to boot. "You were carded, you were carded, you were carded by a girl!"
|
|
|
Post by brett on Oct 15, 2007 10:18:59 GMT 10
It makes me sick to the stomach seeing the scum cut our lead down by three points thanks to a goal and an assist from Griffo NOT TO MENTION the drag-down from Laybutt that clearly deserved a red and then us missing out on a result thanks to this bullshit red card.
Anyone who says '50-50' or 'yellow at worst' needs to watch the replay - it wasn't even worth a free kick.
It seems that the referees have made up for what was actually a fairly good first 6 weeks by unleashing all their shit in the last two - mostly against us and in favour of the scum.
|
|
|
Post by Ursus on Oct 15, 2007 10:24:44 GMT 10
Do you reckon Laybutt will be cited for the elbow?
|
|
|
Post by Pete on Oct 15, 2007 10:27:30 GMT 10
By 50/50, Brett, I meant that the ball was there for both challengers to get -a 50/50 chance either of them could get the ball cleanly, a 50/50 chance they couldn't. Wasn't meaning that it was 50% good tackle, 50% bad and possibly worthy of a free kick or card. Sorry for any confusion.
|
|
|
Post by thesandman on Oct 15, 2007 10:41:08 GMT 10
Pete - a red card MUST carry a minimum 1 match suspension. That's come from FIFA - so the FFA, unfortunately, have no choice but to suspend him.
I would hope that - as you said - there's a little note next to it saying that it shouldn't be used against him in future cases....
I can't even remember Laybutt's elbow.
Graham Poll believes that referees should be able to talk to the media about controberisal decisions. Heck, this could be achieved by something as simple as a printed statement, or through a press conference or interview with a media liaison. There's a number of ways to do it - I certainly think Poll is onto something here.
|
|
|
Post by bakery5 on Oct 15, 2007 10:51:42 GMT 10
He had the fat yellow line i.e Bluetongue Stadium security met him in the middle You know you f***ed it up when they meet you in the middle of the pitch
|
|
|
Post by Pete on Oct 15, 2007 11:03:20 GMT 10
Pete - a red card MUST carry a minimum 1 match suspension. That's come from FIFA - so the FFA, unfortunately, have no choice but to suspend him. I would hope that - as you said - there's a little note next to it saying that it shouldn't be used against him in future cases.... I can't even remember Laybutt's elbow. Graham Poll believes that referees should be able to talk to the media about controberisal decisions. Heck, this could be achieved by something as simple as a printed statement, or through a press conference or interview with a media liaison. There's a number of ways to do it - I certainly think Poll is onto something here. It's a shame that Porter gets the suspension then. As for Grahame Poll, wasn't aware he offered the opinion of talking about controversial decisions. I'm afraid I'm old school in that area tho, don't believe that refs should be making statements of any sort post or pre game. At judiciary hearings, though, they should be made subject to cross examination (does this occur already?). I also don't believe that players should front up to the ref at all, before during or post games. During the game I feel the ref should make it clear that no confrontation is going to be tolerated - only captains to ask. And then yellow the first player to cross that line and dispute a call. Without trying to sound like some old codger, I feel there's too much chatting, backslapping and friendly banter going on between the officials and the players at times on the field, while the game is underway.
|
|
skilbeck
State League player
aloisi johnny aloisi aloisi he's a mariner
Posts: 321
|
Post by skilbeck on Oct 15, 2007 11:06:43 GMT 10
Pete - a red card MUST carry a minimum 1 match suspension. That's come from FIFA - so the FFA, unfortunately, have no choice but to suspend him. I would hope that - as you said - there's a little note next to it saying that it shouldn't be used against him in future cases.... I can't even remember Laybutt's elbow. Graham Poll believes that referees should be able to talk to the media about controberisal decisions. Heck, this could be achieved by something as simple as a printed statement, or through a press conference or interview with a media liaison. There's a number of ways to do it - I certainly think Poll is onto something here. I agree in the after match press conference with the managers, the ref should have to give a statement and accept questions from the press and other people in attendance. They have to tell us what was going through their mind when they make the decisions they do. I believe there should be a rule change where an appeal to the governing body can overturn the refs decision on the field when it has implications for future matches.
|
|
marinermick
Moderator
Coming to Bay 16 Soon
Posts: 8,657
|
Post by marinermick on Oct 15, 2007 11:16:30 GMT 10
I disagree about the notion of profiling referees or even getting them at press conferences.
The referees are there to do a job, not become media personalities. If this was ever to occur the referees will start imposing themselves on the game and make sure that they are the centre of attention.
I believe in the notion that if you forget that the referee is out there then he/she is having a good game.
If we turn them into celebrities then their egos may run rampant and this will have an even more severe impact on the match.
On the other side of the coin, however, there needs to be some sort of accountability in place for their actions as there seems to be very little at the moment.
|
|
|
Post by thesandman on Oct 15, 2007 11:20:05 GMT 10
I don't think that will happen - sanctity of the referees and all that.
The biggest problem with that happening is what would happen at local level, particularly when judiciaries tend to be biased in favour of players and against referees. You'd have massive problems there
I'm starting to get over this whole concept of the referee's decisions being sacred. At the lower levels? Yeah, that's the only way it can be. At these levels where each incident is recorded by several cameras? The concept of 'the referee's decision being final' is starting to cause more problems than it's solving (case in point, Joel Griffiths). I'm starting to think there would be a case for permitting overruling decisions in elite matches with video review and the money for a professional review committee. Heck, if we had professional (full time) referees they could even attend the video review on their own match, help keep it fair.
I think that in the occasional, extreme incident there should be the potential for the referee to be overruled.
Although I could also see this causing a lot of frustration....for instance this season there's been a number of cases where players should've been sent off for denying a goalscoring opportunity, but weren't - so would this concept mean they do get suspended anyway? Could end up causing more frustration than it solves (even though it's the wrong decision by the ref to start with). Who knows.
Pete - I completely agree with you that WAY too much dissent is tolerated, particularly these instances of several players getting in the referee's face (of course I'm probably a bit biased being a ref myself - the more it happens on TV, the more I have to put up with it on my own games). And while there may be a bit too much banter going on, sometimes a bit of friendly banter will calm a player down a lot more than a hard line.
Mick - the only reason I think that referees should provide some sort of statement is that I believe that at times the public needs to know what the hell happened, and I also think people will be a lot more forgiving if the ref says 'well, this is how I saw it, so that's why I gave the decision I did'. A press conference like the coaches get probably isn't the answer, it is something you'd want to keep fairly quiet because you don't want the referees to be the centre of attention too much, but a balance can be achieved.
|
|
|
Post by Pete on Oct 15, 2007 11:26:43 GMT 10
I agree in the after match press conference with the managers, the ref should have to give a statement and accept questions from the press and other people in attendance. They have to tell us what was going through their mind when they make the decisions they do. I believe there should be a rule change where an appeal to the governing body can overturn the refs decision on the field when it has implications for future matches. Sorry that's where we have to agree to disagree. I believe that the match officials should submit a match report as they do now, and not answer any questions about their decisions or performance, nor made to participate in the media circus post match. I suspect that if a ref made an inappropriate comment (written or verbal doesn't matter) about a player or coach outside of the legal immunity that they have whilst officiating a game of football, they may find themselves subject to legal suit (ie Libel, Defamation of Character). However, the match should be reviewed by a match review panel and the refs should be made to account for controversial decisions, and poor performances. Refs should also be open to cross examination by all participants in a judiciary hearing too (if they aren't already made to do so). Both the Match Review Panel and Judiciary Hearing transcripts and decisions should be made public and on the FFA website.
|
|