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Post by littlelol on Dec 14, 2006 11:58:12 GMT 10
FA to raise video replays issue
The Football Association is set to lobby Fifa for the introduction of video replays to identify and punish players guilty of diving.
Football's world governing body is set to meet in March and the FA hopes to raise the issue then.
"We've already asked Fifa to allow retrospective punishments and we will ask again," said an FA spokesman.
"We want to convince them it's in the interests of fairness and the image of the game."
The spokesman added: "Whether it will be a formal item for discussion or any other business kind of thing we really don't know at this moment in time.
"We are the only nation pursuing this."
Should FIFA back this move and force all leagues to follow suit.
"I THINK SO"
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marinermick
Moderator 
Coming to Bay 16 Soon
Posts: 8,657
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Post by marinermick on Dec 14, 2006 12:02:15 GMT 10
If it gets to the A-league then Joel Griffiths and Allesandro are screwed.
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Post by DJ on Dec 14, 2006 12:08:57 GMT 10
about time! I see no reason why we can't review video evidence and fine or suspend people for cheating! I hate divers!
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Post by Bearinator on Dec 14, 2006 12:16:19 GMT 10
Christiano Ronaldo = GGGOOOOONNNNNEEEEEE
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Post by Foriegnmariner on Dec 14, 2006 15:44:54 GMT 10
corradi+ Grosso= Gooooooooooooooooonnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnneeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
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Post by omni on Dec 14, 2006 18:28:21 GMT 10
If it gets to the A-league then Joel Griffiths and Allesandro are screwed. Yep, which is why I hope it gets in. Can we also suspend referees for missing blatant dives, surely referees must shoulder some blame for diving occuring in matches? |
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Post by DJ on Dec 15, 2006 7:53:34 GMT 10
If it gets to the A-league then Joel Griffiths and Allesandro are screwed. Yep, which is why I hope it gets in. Can we also suspend referees for missing blatant dives, surely referees must shoulder some blame for diving occuring in matches? In their defence it can be easy to miss Makes me wonder thou, with this ruling will referees start assuming that people are not diving and award more fouls? Could be a good tactic for some players, take a dive, win a penalty (and the game), but then get suspended? Take 1 for the team? |
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Post by Rubbernose on Dec 15, 2006 11:46:55 GMT 10
about time! I see no reason why we can't review video evidence and fine or suspend people for cheating! I hate divers! Oh, farken oath, but IMO there is a reason FIFA have been reluctant to do anything other than pay the issue lip service, and that's because to introduce something like the above would probably not go down to well among a plethora of world football's powerbrokers. I mean hey, lets be honest here and see if we can start to make a list of potential nations who would be none too impressed to see diving and play acting taken out of their repertoire; - Italy - Portugal - Spain - Holland (to a degree, as well as France) - Mexico (ditto) - Brazil - Argentina - Uruguay - (I'll save a bit of time here and just say "pretty much all of Sth America") - 1/3 of Asia (when they play us) - a good 1/3 of the G14 - save some more time: pretty much the entire Latin/Spanish speaking world Sepp Blatter is up for election next year. He'll sit down with the FA, nod his head and agree with them, humour them, and then ask where the best local restaurants are, before walking out and forgetting about it. |
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Post by dibo (pron. "DIB-OH") on Dec 15, 2006 11:55:43 GMT 10
Should FIFA back this move and force all leagues to follow suit. "I THINK SO" diving in the a-league is not a big issue. paging joel griffiths, your flippers and snorkle are ready... video reply would end up slowing the game and detract from the entertaining value that football (socccer) has over other codes like NRL, AFL and that american football shite you haven't actually read the proposal have you? the idea is to review the video after the game. then apply penalties. |
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Post by dibo (pron. "DIB-OH") on Dec 15, 2006 12:04:11 GMT 10
about time! I see no reason why we can't review video evidence and fine or suspend people for cheating! I hate divers! Oh, farken oath, but IMO there is a reason FIFA have been reluctant to do anything other than pay the issue lip service, and that's because to introduce something like the above would probably not go down to well among a plethora of world football's powerbrokers. I mean hey, lets be honest here and see if we can start to make a list of potential nations who would be none too impressed to see diving and play acting taken out of their repertoire; - Italy - Portugal - Spain - Holland (to a degree, as well as France) - Mexico (ditto) - Brazil - Argentina - Uruguay - (I'll save a bit of time here and just say "pretty much all of Sth America") - 1/3 of Asia (when they play us) - a good 1/3 of the G14 - save some more time: pretty much the entire Latin/Spanish speaking world Sepp Blatter is up for election next year. He'll sit down with the FA, nod his head and agree with them, humour them, and then ask where the best local restaurants are, before walking out and forgetting about it. there's politics, then there's ca$h. the politics don't work, as you've just explained. what does work is the cash angle - the english league introduced 3pt wins to encourage enterprising football and introduce a real sum gain for going for the win rather than sticking for a draw - even if you lose as often as you win. it took a few years, but FIFA followed and introduced 3pt wins in the 1994 world cup. if the FA can argue that it should again be able to be a testbed, then for a start you get (in metaphorical terms) a paddock where you can let it loose, safely quarantined inside the fence, and then break it in and knock out the nasty habits. this means that again, the FA can develop the concept so it's ready for application more widely. but where's the money dibo, i hear you plead. a league where players have to keep their feet and go for goal unless fouled will have two effects - more determined attacking (can't go down softly, you've got to keep going if you can) and more assured defending (if you can make the tackle, do it, and don't worry about the prick diving over you). this is just the sort of thing that the FA will love, and english fans (and players!) will love even more. i think it'd have a genuinely positive effect on crowds, and therefore revenue. so there's the ca$h angle.[/rant] |
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Spike
Local league player
Posts: 144
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Post by Spike on Dec 15, 2006 15:27:29 GMT 10
I think its a half-arsed measure to do it after the games then apply penalties.
How hard could it possible be for the ref to blow the whistle on a suspect tackle/dive, refer to a video ref on the sideline for one, maybe two replays, then award either team with a penalty, and a card to the offender if guilty. There are times NOW in the league when the ref is whistle happy and blows it every two minutes, then there are times when the game flows and the whistle goes maybe 20 times a match. In my opinion, that wouldnt change with a quick video ref on the sideline.
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Post by thesandman on Dec 15, 2006 16:45:31 GMT 10
At the elite level it does seem that referees ARE letting dives go...especially in the World Cup, it would seem that referees are choosing not to punish dives and take the easy option out.
However, FIFA are to blame for this - they have a history of destroying the careers of referees who have the balls to make a difficult call which FIFA disagree with. It's little wonder that often elite referees are seen to not have the balls to make the tough calls, that's because such calls tend to not be forgiven or forgotten by FIFA or other relevant bodies. So the problem of referees not penalising dives that they see goes beyond them. FIFA had this big spiel about punishing diving at the WC, but I daresay the referees would still be reluctant to make a tough call due to FIFA's attitude towards referees.
However, diving IS extremely difficult to spot. For one, the referee has to be absolutely, 100% certain. The think is, it's a lot easier to make a decision as a spectator, when your decision doesn't carry any weight, than it is as a referee. That's the same in all walks of life - it's easier to make a decision when your decision carries no weight (also, because the decision has no effect it's easier to jump to conclusions without considering everything objectively, or with all due consideration). That's one reason why I can stand there as a spectator and say, with certainty, that it was a dive, when the ref might not be so sure. And if the ref has any doubt, he can't pick it up.
Also, just because a player falls weirdly it doesn't mean it's a dive. Sometimes your knees can suddenly buckle with the slightest touch, sometimes if your weigh is positioned awkwardly you'll fall strangely, or if you try to keep your feet when you've got no hope you'll fall weirdly - so often spectators will think it's a dive when it's one of those reasons!
But ultimately a dive is VERY hard to spot for referees. I support video evidence for diving, though diving isn't the only issue - you also have idiots roling around, or staying down pretending to be injured, which is even harder to discipline.
Of course, if you're going to caution post-match for a dive, then they would also have to REMOVE a caution post-match for an incorrectly recognised dive (remember Griffiths last year? Incorrectly sent off for a 2nd yellow card for a dive that clearly wasn't! To be fair, the 2nd yellow should be wiped, hence the RC would be wiped).
Football does not lend itself to an in-match video replay. Spike's suggestion is not practical, football does not have the stoppages for video replays. Furthermore, the ref would look like an idiot, and players and spectators would get frustrated, if play is stopped for a minute or two to view a replay, with the result being 'nothing there, drop ball'. The effect it could have on disrupting a team's momentum is completely unfair, it simply would not work. Same reason why we're never going to stop play to check the video for something in the box, or a possible goal.
However, there MAY be scope for the 4th official to review incidents on-the-fly, and tell the ref then and there (A few minutes after the incident) - this could be applied to a number of different things, however you'd need very strict rules on what could be monitored here otherwise you're opening up a big can of worms.
The other problem is that often a video is inconclusive to a dive - remember the cheating Italians at the WC? Let's be honest and objective here, that video is quite controversial, nobody in authority would say that's a dive after the match.
Then you've also gotta say 'well, there shouldn't have been a penalty, but the result from the penalty stands'. It'd be like FIFA officially saying 'you guys got cheated out of the WC, but we're not going to make it up to you, stiff shit). If you're going to have match results overturned on a wrong dive decision then it starts getting out of hand, which is why you'd never have that, even with post-match decisions on diving.
I think large fines for the team of a player caught diving - fine ONLY to be awarded upon video review (otherwise the ref would be even MORE reluctant to caution for diving, with a bigger penalty directly attached to his decision) would be necessary.
Ultimately, cheating has become part of football culture. Thankfully not TOO much here....though we even see a bit of feigning injury to draw video ref attention on NRL, which is sad...
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Post by Rubbernose on Dec 16, 2006 11:56:58 GMT 10
I think its a half-arsed measure to do it after the games then apply penalties. How hard could it possible be for the ref to blow the whistle on a suspect tackle/dive, refer to a video ref on the sideline for one, maybe two replays, then award either team with a penalty, and a card to the offender if guilty. There are times NOW in the league when the ref is whistle happy and blows it every two minutes, then there are times when the game flows and the whistle goes maybe 20 times a match. In my opinion, that wouldnt change with a quick video ref on the sideline. I suppose it depends on what the ref would refer to video evidence for. There is certainly some potential to majorly disrupt the flow of a match IMO. With regards retrospective video evidence for penalising divers, what happens if someone dives, wins a penalty, penalty scored, match won, and then the player is later charged with diving? It would make a mockery of the match result. And, mind you, it would probably not deter players from indulging if it were to put their team into, say, the final 8 of the WC. |
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Post by Jesus on Dec 19, 2006 19:16:26 GMT 10
Refs also have an important job to protect the players health. That is why for a referee in a game, it can be hard to find the right answer. The last thing a ref needs is to card a player for diving, and then have the player have an injury.
After the game is a great idea. And really should have been around for a long time already. The important thing is to make large penalties. As said earlier players could still take the dive for the penalty and secure the goal, and miss a week. But if penalties increase over a career, rather than a year, at least whilst in the same league, then this can be stamped out to a large extent. Though never 100%.
But imagine if for your 5th offence at diving you were suspended 10 games or more. It would surely limit diving. And if someone got done 5 times in a season, they would probably only play a few games in that season.
Personally, I cant wait til they stamp it out
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Post by Pete on Dec 20, 2006 2:58:03 GMT 10
Career cumulative would be a good idea, I can imagine a renowned diver who has had several suspensions (and his next one likely to be a big one) getting tapped on the heels, taking a tumble and getting up as quick as a greyhound and gesticulating to the ref he's OK, VERY OK!!! Would be a dream come true for me.
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Post by mariners4ever on Dec 20, 2006 15:32:17 GMT 10
Career cumulative would be a good idea, I can imagine a renowned diver who has had several suspensions (and his next one likely to be a big one) getting tapped on the heels, taking a tumble and getting up as quick as a greyhound and gesticulating to the ref he's OK, VERY OK!!! Would be a dream come true for me. that would be good to see the likes robben and the whole italian team getting up straight away |
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